# LANGUAGE translation of https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/stallman-mec-india.html # Copyright (C) YEAR Free Software Foundation, Inc. # This file is distributed under the same license as the original article. # FIRST AUTHOR , YEAR. # #, fuzzy msgid "" msgstr "" "Project-Id-Version: stallman-mec-india.html\n" "POT-Creation-Date: 2021-12-25 21:25+0000\n" "PO-Revision-Date: YEAR-MO-DA HO:MI+ZONE\n" "Last-Translator: FULL NAME \n" "Language-Team: LANGUAGE \n" "Language: \n" "MIME-Version: 1.0\n" "Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8\n" "Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit\n" #. type: Content of: msgid "" "Stallman's Speech at Model Engineering College About Software Patent Dangers " "- GNU Project - Free Software Foundation" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h2> msgid "The Danger of Software Patents (2001)" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><address> msgid "by Richard Stallman" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><p> msgid "" "Speech given at Model Engineering College, Government of Kerala, India, 2001 " "(<a href=\"//audio-video.gnu.org/audio/rms-mec-india.ogg\">audio " "recording</a>)" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><h3> msgid "Summary" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#intro\">Introduction of the speaker</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#conf\">Stallman's speech</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "" "<a href=\"#conf1\">There are two things wrong with the phrase " "“intellectual property.”</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "" "<a href=\"#conf2\">Copyrights and patents have nothing to do with each " "other.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#conf3\">How the patent system works.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#conf4\">You have to work with a lawyer.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#conf5\">Avoid the patent.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#conf6\">License the patent.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#conf7\">Challenge the validity of the patent.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#conf8\">Nobody can reinvent the entire field of software.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "" "<a href=\"#conf9\">The relationship between patents and products varies " "between the fields.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#conf10\">Program development is hampered by software patents.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#conf11\">What can a country do to avoid this problem?</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "" "<a href=\"#conf12\">Preventing India from having software patents will be up " "to the citizens of India.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "" "<a href=\"#conf13\">Businesses should demand opposition to software " "patents.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "" "<a href=\"#conf14\">It's important for countries to work together against " "this.</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#questions\">Questions from the audience</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#questions1\">Questions about software patents</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><ul><li><ul><li> msgid "<a href=\"#questions2\">Questions about free software</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h3> msgid "Introduction of the speaker" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "<em>Prof. Jyothi John, Head of Computer Engineering Department introduces " "Stallman:</em>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "It's my privilege and duty to welcome the most distinguished guest ever we " "had in this college." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Mr. Richard Mathew Stallman launched the development of the GNU operating " "system in 1984, the goal being to create a completely free Unix-like " "operating system. The organization that was founded in 1985 to further this " "purpose is the Free Software Foundation." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Stallman is a visionary of computing in our times, and is the genius behind " "programs such as Emacs, GCC, the GNU debugger and more. Most importantly, " "he's the author of the GNU General Public License, the license under which " "more than half of all free software is distributed and developed. The " "combination of GNU with Linux, the kernel, called the GNU/Linux operating " "system, now has an estimated twenty million users worldwide." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Stallman's concept of free software talks about freedom, rather than about " "price. His ideas go a long way into ensuring development of software for " "the welfare of society, collectively developed by programmers who do not " "“lock up” their work, but rather release it for others to study, " "modify and redistribute." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Stallman received the Grace Hopper award from the Association for Computing " "Machinery for 1991, in 1990 he was awarded MacArthur Foundation " "Fellowship—other recipients of this prestigious award include Noam " "Chomsky and Tim Berners-Lee. In 1996, an honorary doctorate of Technology " "from the Royal Institute, Sweden was awarded to him. In 1998, he received " "the Electronic Frontier Foundation's Pioneer award, along with Linus " "Torvalds. In 1999 he received the Yuri Rubinski Memorial award." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Today, Stallman will be talking about the danger of software patents. In " "fact this is one of the most important aspect of the freedom of programming " "because the aspect of software patents may make all programmers potential " "lawbreakers because unknowingly they may be violating some of the patents " "registered by some other company." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h3> msgid "Stallman's speech" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "After that introduction, I am sure many of you want to know about free " "software. But unfortunately that's not what I am supposed to speak about. " "In fact, this topic, software patents, is <em>not</em> very closely related " "to the issue of free software. Software patents are a danger that affect " "all programmers and all computer users. I found out about them, of course, " "in working on free software because they are a danger to my project as well " "as to every other software project in the world." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "" "There are two things wrong with the phrase “intellectual " "property.”" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "There is a very unfortunate phrase that you may have heard. It is the " "phrase “intellectual property.” Now, there are two things wrong " "with this phrase." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "One—it prejudges the most important policy question about how to treat " "some kind of ideas or practices or works, or whatever. It assumes that they " "are going to be treated as some kind of property. Now, this is a public " "policy decision and you should be able to consider various alternatives to " "choose the best one. Which means you shouldn't name the whole field, name " "the question with a term that prejudges what kind of answer you use." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "But second and even more fundamental, that term is actually a catchall for " "totally different areas of law, including copyrights, patents, trademarks, " "trade secrets and various other things as well. Now these areas of the law " "in fact have almost nothing in common. What the laws say is totally " "different from one to the next. Their origins are completely independent " "and the public policy issues they raise are completely different. So, the " "only intelligent way to think about them is to pick one of them and think " "about it; think about them separately." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So the intelligent way to talk about them is never to generalize about them " "but to talk about a specific one, you know, talk about copyrights, or talk " "about patents, or talk about trademarks, but never lump them all together as " "intellectual property because that's a recipe for simplistic conclusions. " "It's almost impossible to think intelligently about “intellectual " "property” and so I refuse to do that. I just tell people why the term " "is a mistake, and then if you ask me for my opinion on copyrights or my " "opinion on patents, it will take me an hour to tell you it. But they are " "two different opinions, and my opinion about trademarks is something " "completely different as well." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "Copyrights and patents have nothing to do with each other." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So the most important thing for you to start with is never mix copyrights " "and patents as topics. They have nothing to do with each other. Let me " "tell you some of the basic differences between copyrights and patents:" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><ul><li> msgid "" "A copyright deals with a particular work, usually a written work, and it has " "to do with the details of that work. Ideas are completely excluded. " "Patents, by contrast—well, a patent covers an idea. It's that simple, " "and any idea that you can describe, that's what a patent might restrict you " "from doing." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><ul><li> msgid "" "Copyrights have to do with copying. If you wrote something that was word " "for word the same as some famous novel, and you could prove that you did " "this while you were locked up in a room and you have never seen that novel, " "this would not be copyright violation because it's not copying. But a " "patent is an absolute monopoly on using a particular idea. And even if you " "could show that you thought of it on your own, that would be considered " "totally irrelevant. It doesn't help you." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><ul><li> msgid "" "Copyrights exist automatically. Whenever anything is written, it's " "copyrighted. Patents are issued through an expensive application process. " "There is an expensive fee and even more expense in paying lawyers, which of " "course tends to be good for big companies. And the patent office says that " "it only issues patents for things that are unobvious. However, practically " "speaking, in many patent offices the criterion is unobvious to somebody with " "an IQ of fifty. And they have all sorts of excuses to ignore the fact that " "whenever any programmer looks at it, his first statement is “this is " "absurd, it's obvious.” They say “well, this is hindsight.” " "So they just have an excuse to completely ignore the judgment of everybody " "who really is a programmer." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><ul><li> msgid "" "Copyrights last an extremely long time. In the US today it's possible for " "copyrights to last for 150 years, which is absurd. Patents don't last that " "long; they merely last for a long time—20 years, which in the field of " "software, as you can imagine, is a long time." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "There are many other differences as well. In fact every detail is " "different. So the worst thing you should ever do is learn something about " "copyrights and suppose that the same is true of patents. No, more likely " "it's not true of patents. If it's true of copyrights, it's not true for " "patents. That would be a better guideline if you have to guess." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "How the patent system works." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now most of the time when people describe how the patent system works, they " "are people with a vested interest in the system. And so they describe the " "patent system from the point of view of somebody who wants to get a patent " "and then point it at programmers and say “hand me your money.” " "This is natural, you know; when they sell lottery tickets, they talk about " "people who win, not people who lose. Of course most of the people lose, but " "they don't want you to think about that, so they talk about the ones who " "win. It's the same with patents. The patent system is a very expensive " "lottery for its participants. But of course, the people who run the system " "want you to think about the small chance you might win." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So to redress this imbalance, I am going to explain what the patent system " "looks like from the point of view of somebody who might be the victim of a " "patent; that is, somebody who wants to develop software. Suppose that you " "want to develop a program and you are in a country that has software " "patents. How do you have to deal with the patent system?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Well, the first thing is you have to find out about the patents that might " "potentially affect your area. This is impossible, because patents that are " "in the pipeline, being considered by the patent office, are secret. Well, " "in some countries they are published after 18 months but that still gives " "plenty of time for them to be secret. So you might develop a program this " "year, which is perfectly legal and safe this year. And then next year, a " "patent could be issued and all of a sudden you could be sued. It happens. Or " "your users could get sued." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "For instance, in 1984 the Compress program was developed and, since it was " "free software, it was distributed by many companies along with Unix " "systems. Well, in 1985, a US patent was issued on the LZW compression " "algorithm used by Compress, and after a few years Unisys began squeezing " "money out of various companies." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Well, since we in the GNU project needed a data compression program and " "since we could not use Compress, we began looking for some other compression " "program. We found out about… Somebody came forward and said: " "“I have been working on this algorithm for a year and now I have " "decided I am going to contribute it to you, and here is the code.” We " "were a week away from releasing this program when I just happened to see a " "copy of the New York Times, which doesn't happen very often, and it just " "happened to have the weekly patents column and I noted it and so I read it. " "It said that somebody had got a patent for inventing a new method, a better " "method of data compression. Well, that was not in fact true." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "When I saw this, I thought we'd better get a copy of this patent and see if " "it's a problem, and it turned out to cover exactly the algorithm that we " "were about to release. So this program was killed one week before it was " "released. And in fact that person, that patent holder, had not invented a " "better method, because in fact it wasn't new. But that doesn't matter, he " "had a monopoly." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Eventually we found another compression algorithm which is used in the " "program that's known as GZIP. But this illustrates the danger that you " "face: even if you had unlimited resources, you couldn't find out about all " "the patents that might endanger your project. But you can find out about " "the issued patents because they are published by the patent office. So in " "principle, you could read them all, and see what they restrict, what they " "prohibit you from doing. Practically speaking though, once there are " "software patents there are so many of them that you can't keep up with them." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "In the US there are over a hundred thousand of them; maybe two hundred " "thousand by now. This is just an estimate. I know that 10 years ago they " "were issuing 10,000 a year and I believe that it has accelerated since " "then. So it's too much for you to keep track of them unless that's your " "full-time job. Now you can try to search for the ones that are relevant to " "what you are doing, and this works some of the time. If you search for " "certain keywords or follow links, you'll find some patents that are relevant " "to what you're doing. You won't find them <em>all</em>." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "A few years ago somebody had a US patent—maybe it's expired by " "now—on natural order recalculation in spreadsheets. Now, what does " "this mean? It means the original spreadsheets did the recalculation always " "from top to bottom. Which meant that if a cell ever depended on a lower " "cell, then it wouldn't get recalculated the first time; you'd have to do " "another recalculation to get that one. Clearly it's better to do the " "recalculation in the order, you know. If A depends on B, then do B first " "and then do A. This way a single recalculation will make everything " "consistent. Well, that's what the patent covered." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now, if you searched for the term spreadsheet, you would not have found that " "patent because that term did not appear in it. The phrase “natural " "order recalculation” didn't appear either. This algorithm—and " "it was indeed the algorithm that they covered, basically every imaginable " "way of coding this algorithm—the algorithm is called topological " "sorting, and that term did not appear in the patent either. It presented " "itself as a patent on a technique for compilation. So, reasonable searching " "would not have found this patent but it would still have been a basis to sue " "you." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "In fact you can't tell what a software patent covers even roughly, except by " "studying it carefully. This is different from patents in other areas, " "because in other areas there is some physical thing happening, and the " "details of that physical thing usually give you a sort of anchor so that you " "can tell whether it relates or not. But in software there is no such thing, " "and so it's easy for two totally different ways of saying something to " "cover, in fact, the same computation, and it takes careful study to see that " "they cover the same one. Because of this, even the patent office can't keep " "track. So, there is not one, but two patents covering LZW data " "compression. The first one was issued in 1985 and I think the second one in " "1989. But that one I think had been applied for even earlier. One of these " "patents belongs to Unisys and the other belongs to IBM." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now, this kind of mistake is not in fact that rare. It's not the only one. " "You see, patent examiners don't have a lot of time to spend on one patent. " "In the US they have an average of 17 hours per patent. Now that's not " "enough to carefully study all the other patents in the area to see if they " "are really the same thing. So they are going to make this kind of mistake " "over and over." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "You have to work with a lawyer." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So you won't find all the patents that might threaten you but you'll find " "some of them. Then what do you do? You have to try to figure out precisely " "what these patents prohibit. That is very hard, because patents are written " "in tortuous legal language which is very hard for an engineer to " "understand. You are going to have to work with a lawyer to do it." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "In the 1980's the Australian government commissioned a study of the patent " "system—the patent system in general, not software patents. This study " "concluded that Australia would be better off abolishing the patent system " "because it did very little good for society and caused a lot of trouble. " "The only reason they didn't recommend that was international pressure. So " "one of the things they cited was that patents, which were supposed to " "disclose information so that it would no longer be secret, were in fact " "useless for that purpose. Engineers never looked at patents to try to learn " "anything, because it's too hard to read them. In fact they quoted an " "engineer saying “I can't recognize my own inventions in patent " "deeds.” Now this is not just theoretical." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "A few years ago, an engineer in the US named Paul Heckel was suing Apple. " "He got a couple of software patents in the late 80's for a software package, " "and then when he saw Hypercard he looked at it and said “ this is " "nothing like my program,” and didn't think anymore of it. But then " "later on, his lawyer explained to him that if you read his patents " "carefully, Hypercard fell into the prohibited area. So he sued Apple, " "figuring this was an opportunity to get some money. Well, once when I gave " "a speech like this, he was in the audience, and he said “oh no that's " "not true, I just wasn't aware of the scope of my protection.” And I " "said “yeah, that's what I said.”" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So you are going to have to spend a lot of time working with a lawyer and " "explaining to the lawyer what project you are working on, so the lawyer can " "explain to you what the patents imply. This is going to be expensive, and " "when you're done the lawyer will tell you something like this: “If you " "do something in this area, you are almost sure to lose a lawsuit. If you do " "something in this area, you are in a substantial danger, and if you really " "want to be safe you'd better stay out of this area, and, of course there is " "a substantial element of chance in the outcome of any lawsuit.” So now " "that you have a predictable terrain for doing business, what are you going " "to do?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "Well, you have three options to consider:" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><ul><li> msgid "you can try to <a href=\"#conf5\">avoid the patent</a>," msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><ul><li> msgid "you can try to <a href=\"#conf6\">license the patent</a>," msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><ul><li> msgid "or you can try to <a href=\"#conf7\">challenge its validity</a> in court" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "Any one of these three is sometimes a viable alternative, and sometimes not." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "Avoid the patent." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "First, let's consider avoiding the patent. Well, in some cases that's " "easy. You know, Unisys was threatening people using the patent on LZW " "compression; we just had to find another data compression algorithm and we " "could avoid that patent. Well, that was somewhat difficult because there " "were many other patents covering lots of other data compression algorithms. " "But eventually we found one that was not in the area that those others' " "patents cover; eventually we did. So that program was implemented. It " "actually gave better compression results and so we now have GZIP, and a lot " "of people use GZIP. So, in that one case it was considerable work but we " "were able to do it, to avoid that patent." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "But in the 80's, CompuServe defined an image format called GIF and used LZW " "compression in defining it. Well, of course once the uproar about these " "patents became known, people defined another image format using a different " "compression algorithm. They used the GZIP algorithm, and that format is " "called PNG format, which I suppose means “PNG is Not GIF.”" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "But there was a problem: lots of people had already started using GIF " "format, and there were many programs that could display GIF format and " "produce GIF format and they couldn't display PNG format. So the result was " "people felt it was too hard to switch. You see, when you are dealing with a " "data compression program used by somebody who says “I want to compress " "some data,” well, you can give him a different data compression " "program; if he can get sued for using this one and you give him another one, " "he'll switch; but if what he wants to do is make images that can be " "displayed by Netscape, then he can't switch, unless Netscape handles the " "other format… and it didn't." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "It took years, I think, before Netscape started to handle PNG format. So " "people essentially said “I can't switch, I just have… ” " "And so the result was, society had invested so much in this one format, that " "the inertia was too great for a switch, even though there was another " "superior format available." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Even when a patent is rather narrow, avoiding it can be very hard. The " "PostScript specification includes LZW compression, which we in our " "implementation of postScript cannot implement. We support another kind of " "compression in some sense that is not correct, even though it does the " "useful job. So, even a narrow patent is not always feasible to avoid." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now, sometimes a feature gets patented. In that case, you can avoid the " "patent by taking out that feature. In the late 80's the users of the word " "processor XyWrite got a downgrade in the mail. That word processor had a " "feature where you could define a short word or sequence as an abbreviation. " "Whenever you typed in that short sequence and then a space, it would turn " "into a longer expansion. You could define these any way you liked. Then " "somebody patented this, and XyWrite decided to deal with the patent by " "removing the feature. They contacted me because in fact I had put a feature " "like that into the original Emacs editor back in the 70's, many years before " "this patent. So there was a chance that I could provide evidence that would " "enable them to fight the patent." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Well, this showed me that I had at least one patentable idea in my life. I " "know because someone else patented it. Now, of course, you can respond to " "these patented features by taking the features out. But once your program " "starts being missing several features that users want, it might be useless " "as a program." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now you may have heard of Adobe Photoshop. We have a program called the " "GIMP which is more powerful and general than Photoshop. But there is one " "important feature that it doesn't have which is Pantone color matching, " "which is very important for people who want to actually print the images on " "paper and get reliable results. This feature is omitted because it's " "patented. And as a result, the program for one substantial class of users " "is crippled." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "If you look at programs today, you'll see that they often provide many " "features, and the users demand these features. If any important feature is " "missing, well, it's easy to leave it out, but the results may be very bad." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Of course, sometimes a patent is so broad that it's impossible to avoid " "it. Public key encryption is essential for computer users to have " "privacy. The whole field was patented. That patent expired just four years " "ago; there could be no free software in the US for public key encryption, " "until then: many programs, both free and nonfree, were wiped out by the " "patent holders. And in fact that whole area of computing was held back for " "more than a decade despite strong interest." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "License the patent." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So, that is the possibility of avoiding the patent. Another possibility " "that is sometimes available is to license the patent. Now, the patent " "holder is not required to offer you a license that's his whim. The patent " "holder can say “I'm not licensing this, you're just out of business, " "period!”" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "In the League for Programming Freedom, we heard in the early 90's from " "somebody whose family business was making casino games— computerized " "of course—and he had been threatened by somebody who had a patent on a " "very broad category of computerized casino games. The patent covered a " "network where there is more than one machine, and each machine supports more " "than one kind of game and can display more than one game in progress at a " "time." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now, one thing you should realize is the patent office thinks that it's " "really brilliant. If you see that other people implemented doing one thing " "and you decide to support doing two or more—you know, if they made a " "system that plays one game and if you make it able to play more than one " "game—that's an invention. If it can display one game and you decide " "to set it up so that it can display two games at once, that's an invention. " "If he did it with one computer and you do it with a network having multiple " "computers, that's an invention for them. They think that these steps are " "really brilliant." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Of course, we in computer science know that this is just a rule, you can " "generalize anything from one to more than one. It's the most obvious " "principle there is. Every time you write a subroutine, that's what you're " "doing. So this is one of the systematic reasons why the patent system " "produces, and then upholds patents that we would all say are ridiculously " "obvious. You can't assume, just because it's ridiculously obvious, that " "they wouldn't be upheld by a court. They may be legally valid despite the " "fact that are utterly stupid." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So he was faced with this patent and the patent holder was not even offering " "him the chance to get a license. “Shutdown!” is what the patent " "holder said, and that's what he eventually did. He couldn't afford to fight " "it." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "However, many patent holders will offer you a chance of a license. But it " "will cost you dearly. The owners of the natural order recalculation patent " "were demanding five percent of the gross sales of every spreadsheet. And " "that, I was told, was the cheap pre-lawsuit price. If you insisted on " "fighting over the matter, they were going to charge more. Now you could, I " "suppose, sign a license like that for one patent, you could do it for two, " "you could do it for three. But what if there are twenty different patents " "in your program, and each patent holder wants five percent of the gross " "sales? What if there are twenty one of them? Then you are pretty badly " "screwed. But actually business people tell me that two or three such " "patents would be such a big burden that they would make the company fail in " "practice, even if in theory it might have a chance." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So, a license for a patent is not necessarily a feasible thing to do, and " "for us, free software developers, we're in an even worse position because we " "can't even count the copies, and most licenses demand a fee per copy, so " "it's absolutely impossible for us to use one of those licenses. You know, " "if a license charged one millionth part of a rupee for each copy, we would " "be unable to comply because we can't count the copies. The total amount of " "money, I might have in my pocket, but I can't count it so I can't pay it. " "So we suffer some special burdens occasionally." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "But there is one kind of organization for which licensing patents works very " "well, and that is the large multinational corporations; the reason is that " "they own many patents themselves and they use them to force " "cross-licensing. What does this mean? Well, essentially the only defense " "against patents is deterrence: you have to have patents of your own, then " "you hope that if somebody points a patent at you, you will be able point a " "patent back and say “don't sue me, because I'll sue you.”" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "However, deterrence doesn't work as well for patents as it does with nuclear " "weapons, and the reason is that each patent is pointed in a fixed " "direction. It prohibits certain specified activities. So the result is " "that most of the companies that are trying to get some patents to defend " "themselves with, they have no chance of making this a success. They might " "get a few patents, you know. So they might get a patent that points there, " "and they might get a patent that points there. OK, and then, if somebody " "over here threatens this company, what are they going to do? They don't have " "a patent pointing over there, so they have no defense." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Meanwhile, sooner or later, somebody else will wander over there and the " "executive of the company will think “gee, we're not as profitable as I " "would like, why don't I go just squeeze some money out of them.” So " "they say first “we're getting this patent for defensive " "purposes,” but they often change their minds later when a tempting " "victim walks by." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "And this, by the way, is the fallacy in the myth that the patent system " "“protects” the “small inventor.” Let me tell you " "this myth, it's the myth of the starving genius. It's somebody who has been " "working in isolation for years, and starving, and has a brilliant new idea " "for how to do something or other. And so, now, he's starting a company and " "he is afraid some big company like IBM will compete with him, and so he gets " "a patent and this patent is going to “protect him.”" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Well, of course, this is not the way things work in our field. People don't " "make this kind of progress in isolation this way. They are working with " "other people and talking with the other people and they are developing " "software usually. And so the whole scenario doesn't make sense, and " "besides, if he was such a good computer scientist, there was no need for him " "to starve. He could have got a job at any time if he wanted." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "But let's suppose that this happened, and suppose that he has his patent, " "and he says “IBM, you can't compete with me 'cause I've got this " "patent.” But here is what IBM says: “Well, gee, let's look at " "your product, hmm, I have this patent, and this patent and this patent and " "this patent and this patent that your product is violating. So how about if " "we cross-license?” And the starving genius says “hmm, I haven't " "got enough food in my belly to fight these things, so I'd better give " "in.” And so they sign a cross-license, and now guess what—IBM " "can compete with him. He wasn't protected at all!" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now, IBM can do this because they have a lot of patents. They have patents " "pointing here, here, here, everywhere. So, anybody from almost anywhere " "that attacks IBM is facing a stand-off. A small company can't do it but a " "big company can." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So IBM wrote an article. It was in Think magazine, I believe, issue number " "five, 1990—that's IBM's own magazine—an article about IBM's " "patent portfolio. IBM said that it got two kinds of benefit from its 9000 " "active US patents. One benefit was collecting royalties from licenses. But " "the other benefit, the bigger benefit, was access to things patented by " "others. Permission to not be attacked by others with their patents, through " "cross-licensing. And the article said that the second benefit was an order " "of magnitude greater than the first. In other words, the benefit to IBM of " "being able to make things freely, not being sued, was ten times the benefit " "of collecting money for all their patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now the patent system is a lot like a lottery, in that what happens with any " "given patent is largely random and most of them don't bring any benefits to " "their owners. But IBM is so big that these things average out over the " "scale of IBM. So you could take IBM as measuring what the average is like. " "What we see is—and this is a little bit subtle—the benefit to " "IBM of being able to make use of ideas that were patented by others is equal " "to the harm that the patent system would have done to IBM if there were no " "cross-licensing—if IBM really were prohibited from using all those " "ideas that were patented by others." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So what it says is: the harm that the patent system would do is ten times " "the benefit, on the average. Now, for IBM though, this harm doesn't happen, " "because IBM does have 9000 patents and does force most of them to " "cross-license, and avoids the problem. But if you are small, then you can't " "avoid the problem that way, and you will really be facing ten times as much " "trouble as benefit. Anyway, this is why the big multinational corporations " "are in favor of software patents, and they are lobbying governments around " "the world to adopt software patents and saying naive things like “this " "is a new kind of monopoly for software developers, it has to be good for " "them, right?”" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Well, today, after you have heard my speech I hope you understand why that " "isn't true. You have to look carefully at how patents affect software " "developers to see whether they are good or bad, and explaining that is my " "overall purpose." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "Challenge the validity of the patent." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So, that is the possibility of licensing a patent. The third possible " "option is to go to court and challenge the validity of the patent." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now the outcome of this case will depend largely on technicalities, which " "means essentially on randomness, you know. The dice were rolled a few years " "ago, and you can investigate and find out what the dice came up saying, and " "then you'll find out whether you've got a chance. So it's mainly historical " "accident that determines whether the patent is valid—the historical " "accident of whether, or precisely which things, people happen to publish, " "and when." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So, sometimes, there is a possibility of invalidating. So even if a patent " "is ridiculously trivial, sometimes there is a good chance of invalidating it " "and sometimes there is none." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "You can't expect the courts to recognize that it is trivial, because their " "standards are generally much lower than we would think are sensible. In " "fact, in the United States, this has been a persistent tendency. I saw a " "Supreme Court decision from something like 1954, which had a long list of " "patents that were invalidated by the Supreme Court starting in the 1800's. " "And they were utterly ridiculous, like making a certain shape of doorknob " "out of rubber, when previously they'd been made out of wood. And this " "decision rebuked the patent system for going far, far away from the proper " "standards. And they just keep on doing it." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So you can't expect sensible results from that, but there are situations " "where, when you look at the past record, you see that there is a chance to " "invalidate a certain patent. It's worth the try, at least to investigate. " "But the actual court cases happen to be extremely expensive." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "A few years ago, one defendant lost and had to pay 13 million dollars, of " "which most went to the lawyers on the two sides. I think only 5 million " "dollars was actually taken away by the patent holder, and so there were 8 " "million to the lawyers." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "Nobody can reinvent the entire field of software." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now, these are your possible options. At this point, of course, you have to " "write the program. And there, the problem is that you face this situation " "not just once but over and over and over, because programs today are " "complicated. Look at a word processor; you'll see a lot of features, many " "different things, each of which could be patented by somebody, or a " "combination of two of them could be patented by somebody. British Telecom " "has a patent in the US on the combination of following hypertext links and " "letting the user dial up through a phone line. Now these are two basically " "separate things, but the combination of the two is patented." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So, that means if there are 100 things in your program, there are " "potentially some five thousand pairs of two that might be patented by " "somebody already, and there is no law against patenting a combination of " "three of them either. That's just the features, you know. There's going to " "be many techniques that you use in writing a program, many algorithms, they " "could be patented too. So there are lots and lots of things that could be " "patented. The result is that developing a program becomes like crossing a " "field of land mines. Sure, each step probably will not step on a patent, " "each design decision. Chances are it will be safe. But crossing the whole " "field becomes dangerous." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "The best way for a nonprogrammer to understand what this is like is to " "compare the writing of these large programs with another area in which " "people write something very large: symphonies. Imagine if the governments " "of Europe in the 1700's had wanted to promote progress in symphonic music by " "adopting a system of music patents, so that any idea that could be described " "in words could be patented if it seemed to be new and original. So you'd be " "able to patent, say, a three-note melodic motif which is be too short to be " "copyrightable, but it would have been patentable. And maybe they could have " "patented a certain chord progression, and maybe patented using a certain " "combination of instruments playing at the same time, or any other idea that " "somebody could describe." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Well, by 1800 there would have been thousands of these music idea patents. " "And then imagine that you are Beethoven and you want to write a symphony. " "To write a whole symphony, you are going to have to do lots of different " "things, and at any point you could be using an idea that somebody else has " "patented. Of course, if you do that he'll say: “Oh! You are just a " "thief, why can't you write something original?” Well, Beethoven had " "more than his share of new musical ideas, but he used a lot of existing " "musical ideas. He had to, because that's the only way to make it " "recognizable. If you don't do that, people won't listen at all. Pierre " "Boulez thought he was going to totally reinvent the language of music, and " "he tried, and nobody listens to it, because it doesn't use all the ideas " "that they're familiar with." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So you have to use the old ideas that other people have thought of. Nobody " "is such a genius that he can reinvent the entire field of software and do " "useful things without learning anything from anybody else. So in effect, " "those people, the patent holders and their lawyers, they are accusing us of " "being cheaters because we don't totally reinvent the field from scratch. We " "have to build on previous work to make progress, and that is exactly what " "the patent system prohibits us from doing. And we have to provide features " "that the users are accustomed to and can recognize, or they'll find our " "software just too difficult to use no matter how good it is." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "The relationship between patents and products varies between the fields." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now, people sometimes ask me: why is software different from other fields? " "Sometimes, of course they ask this in a rather nasty fashion, they say: " "“the other fields can deal with patents, why should software be an " "exception?” Now that's a nasty way of putting it because it's making " "the assumption that it's wrong to want to escape from a problem. I could " "imagine I am saying: “well, other people could get cancer, why " "shouldn't you?” Clearly, if it's a problem, enabling any field to " "escape is good. But it is a good and serious question: are these fields the " "same issue? Do patents affect all these fields the same way? Is the right " "policy for software the same as the right policy for automobile engines or " "pharmaceuticals or chemical processes, you know, this is a serious question " "which is worth looking at." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "When you look at it, what you see is that the relationship between patents " "and products varies between the fields. At one extreme you have " "pharmaceuticals where typically a whole chemical formula is patented. So if " "you come up with a new drug, then it's not patented by somebody else. At " "the other extreme is software where, when you write a new program, you are " "combining dozens or hundreds of ideas, and we can't expect them all to be " "new. Even an innovative program, which has a few new ideas, has to use lots " "and lots of old ideas too. And in between you find the other fields. Even " "in other fields, you can get patent deadlock." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "When the United States entered World War I, nobody in the US could make a " "modern airplane. And the reason was that modern airplanes use several " "different techniques that were patented by different companies, and the " "owners hated each other. So nobody could get a license to use all these " "patents. Well, the US government decided that this was an unacceptable " "state of affairs, and essentially paid those patent holders a lump sum and " "said “we have nationalized these patents; now, everybody, go make " "airplanes for us!”" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "But the amount to which this happens, the frequency and the seriousness of " "it varies according to how many different ideas go in one product. It " "varies according to how many points of patent vulnerability there are in one " "product. And in that question, software is at the extreme." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "It's not unusual for a few people working for a couple of years to write a " "program that could have a million parts in it, different parts, which is " "maybe, say, 300,000 lines of code. To design a physical system that has a " "million different parts, that's a mega-project, that's very rare. Now " "you'll find many times people make a physical object with a million parts, " "but typically it's many copies of the same subunit and that's much easier to " "design—that's not a million different parts in the design." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So, why is this? The reason is that, in other fields, people have to deal " "with the perversity of matter. You are designing circuits or cars or " "chemicals, you have to face the fact that these physical substances will do " "what they do, not what they are supposed to do. We in software don't have " "that problem, and that makes it tremendously easier. We are designing a " "collection of idealized mathematical parts which have definitions. They do " "exactly what they are defined to do." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "And so there are many problems we don't have. For instance, if we put an " "<code>if</code> statement inside of a <code>while</code> statement, we don't " "have to worry about whether the <code>if</code> statement can get enough " "power to run at the speed it's going to run. We don't have to worry about " "whether it will run at a speed that generates radio frequency interference " "and induces wrong values in some other parts of the data. We don't have to " "worry about whether it will loop at a speed that causes a resonance and " "eventually the <code>if</code> statement will vibrate against the " "<code>while</code> statement and one of them will crack." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "We don't have to worry that chemicals in the environment will get into the " "boundary between the <code>if</code> statement and the <code>while</code> " "statement and corrode them, and cause a bad connection. We don't have to " "worry that other chemicals will get on them and cause a short-circuit. We " "don't have to worry about whether the heat can be dissipated from this " "<code>if</code> statement through the surrounding <code>while</code> " "statement. We don't have to worry about whether the <code>while</code> " "statement would cause so much voltage drop that the <code>if</code> " "statement won't function correctly. When you look at the value of a " "variable you don't have to worry about whether you've referenced that " "variable so many times that you exceed the fan-out limit. You don't have to " "worry about how much capacitance there is in a certain variable and how much " "time it will take to store the value in it." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "All these things are defined a way, the system is defined to function in a " "certain way, and it always does. The physical computer might malfunction, " "but that's not the program's fault. So, because of all these problems we " "don't have to deal with, our field is tremendously easier." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "If we assume that the intelligence of programmers is the same as the " "intelligence of mechanical engineers, and electrical engineers and chemical " "engineers and so on, what's going to happen? Those of us with the easiest " "field, fundamentally, are going to push it further. We make bigger and " "bigger things and eventually it becomes hard again. That's why we can " "develop much bigger systems than the people in the other fields. They just " "have these hard problems to deal with all the time. In the other fields, it " "may be necessary to develop an idea. You may have the idea, but then you " "may have to try out lots of different ways to get it to work at all. In " "software it's not like that, you have the idea and what you go and do is you " "write a program which uses this idea, and then the users may like it or " "not. And if they don't like it, probably you can just fix some details and " "get it to work." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "There is another problem that we don't have to worry about: manufacturing of " "copies. When we put this <code>if</code> statement inside the " "<code>while</code> statement, we don't have to worry about how the " "<code>if</code> statement is going to be inserted into the " "<code>while</code> statement as a copy is being built. We don't have to " "worry either about making sure we have access to remove and replace this " "<code>if</code> statement if it should burn out. So all we have to do is " "type <kbd>copy</kbd> and it's an all-purpose copy-anything facility. People " "making physical equipment and physical products, they can't do that, these " "things have to be built piece by piece each time." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "The result is that for them, the cost of designing a system of a certain " "complexity may be <i>[gesturing]</i> this much and the factory may take this " "much to set up. So they have to deal with this much from the patent " "system. It's a level of overhead they can live with. For us, designing it " "may cost <i>[gesturing]</i> this much and manufacturing it may cost this " "much, so this much overhead from the patent system is crushing." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Another way to look at it is that because we can—a few of us " "can—make a much bigger system, there are many more points of " "vulnerability where somebody might have patented something already. We have " "to walk a long distance through the mine field, whereas they they only have " "to walk a few feet through the minefield. So it's much more of a dangerous " "system for us." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "Program development is hampered by software patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now, you have to realize that the ostensible purpose of the patent system is " "to promote progress. This is something that is often forgotten because the " "companies that benefit from patents like to distract you from it. They like " "to give you the idea that patents exist because they deserve special " "treatment. But this is not what the patent system says. The patent system " "says: the goal is to promote progress for society, by encouraging certain " "behavior like publishing new ideas; and after a certain—originally " "that was fairly short—time, everyone could use them." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Of course there is a certain price that society pays as well, and so we have " "to ask the question: which is bigger, the benefit or the price? Well, in " "other fields, I am not sure. I am not an expert on other fields of " "engineering, I've never done them and I don't know whether having patents is " "good for progress in those fields." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "I have been in software since before software patents existed, and I know " "that software patents do a lot of harm and essentially no good. In the old " "days, ideas came along. Either people in a university had an idea, or " "somebody had an idea while he was working on developing software. And " "either way, these ideas got published, and then everyone could use them. " "Now why did the software publishers publish these ideas? Because they knew " "that the big job was writing the program." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "They knew that publishing the ideas would get them credit from the " "community, and meanwhile anybody else who wanted to compete with them would " "still have to write a program, which is the big job. So they typically kept " "the details of the program secret—of course some of us think that's " "wrong, but that's a different issue. They kept the details of the program " "secret and they published the ideas, and meanwhile the software " "development—because software development was going on—That " "provided the field with a steady stream of ideas, so ideas were not the " "limiting factor. The limiting factor was the job of writing programs that " "would work and that people would like using." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So, in effect, applying the patent system to software focuses on " "facilitating a thing which is not the limiting factor, while causing trouble " "for the thing which is the limiting factor. You see the software patents " "encourage somebody to have an idea, but at the same time they encourage " "people to restrict its use, so in fact we are actually worse off now in " "terms of having ideas we could use, because in the past people had the ideas " "and published them and we could use them, and now they have the ideas and " "patent them and we can't use them for twenty years. In the mean time, the " "real limiting factor—which is developing the programs—this is " "hampered by software patents because of other dangers that I explained to " "you in the first half of this talk." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So the result is that, while the system is supposed to be promoting progress " "in software, actually it is so screwed up it's just obstructing progress." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Today we have some economic research showing mathematically how this can " "happen. You can find it in <a " "href=\"http://www.researchoninnovation.org\">www.researchoninnovation.org</a>. " "I am not completely sure of the name of the paper, but it's one that shows " "that in a field where incremental innovation is typical, having a patent " "system can result in slower progress. In other words the system produces " "counter-intuitive results that are the opposite of what it was intended to " "do. This backs up the intuitive conclusion of every programmer who sees " "that software patents are absurd." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "What can a country do to avoid this problem?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So, what can a country do to avoid this problem? Well, there are two " "approaches: one is to address the problem at the issue of granting patents, " "and the other is to approach it at the point where patents are being " "enforced." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Doing this at the stage of granting patents is not quite as easy as you " "might think. Now, I have been talking about software patents but strictly " "speaking you can't classify patents into hardware patents and software " "patents, because one patent might cover both hardware and software. So in " "fact my definition of a software patent is: a patent that can restrict " "software development." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "And if you look at many software patents you often find that the system they " "describe has a large part of the computer itself as part of the description " "of what's going on. That's a great way of making the whole thing seem " "complicated when it is really trivial. So it's a way they can get the " "patent office to decide it's unobvious." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "But there is a different criterion that can be used, a slightly different " "place to draw the line that still does a reasonable job, and that is between " "processes that transform matter in a specific way, and processes where the " "result is just calculation and display of information, or a combination of " "data processing and display steps—or others have put it as: mental " "steps being carried out by equipment. There are various ways of formulating " "this, which are more or less equivalent." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now this is not exactly the same as prohibiting software patents, because in " "some cases computers are used as part of specific physical equipment to make " "it do a specific thing. And software patents might be allowed if they are " "part of a specific physical activity. But that's not really a disaster. " "After all, once people are involved in a specific physical activity or a " "specific physical product, they are bringing into their whole business all " "those complexities of dealing with matter. So it's more like those other " "fields of engineering. Maybe it's okay to have patents on that narrow kind " "of software. As long as we can keep the core areas of software, the purely " "software activities safe from patents, we have solved the bulk of the " "problem." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So that is a feasible approach and that's what people are working towards in " "Europe. However, that is not going to be any use in the United States " "because the United States already has tens of thousands, probably hundreds " "of thousands of software patents. Any change in the criteria for issuing " "patents does not help at all with the patents that already exist." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So what I propose to the United States is to change the criteria for " "applying patents, to say that <em>purely software systems running on general " "purpose computing hardware are immune from patents</em>. They by definition " "cannot infringe a patent. And this way the patents can still be granted " "exactly the way they are now, and they can still, in a formal sense, cover " "both hardware implementations and software implementations as they do now. " "But software will be safe." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "" "Preventing India from having software patents will be up to the citizens of " "India." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "That's the solution I propose to the US, but it could be used in other " "countries as well." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now, one of the tremendous dangers facing most countries today is the World " "Trade Organization, which sets up a system of corporate regulated " "trade—not free trade as its proponents like to call it, but corporate " "regulated trade. It replaces the regulation of trade by governments, that " "are somewhat democratic and might listen to the interest of their citizens, " "with regulation of trade by businesses, which don't pretend to listen to the " "citizens. So it's fundamentally antidemocratic and ought to be abolished." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "But it's crucial to note that the part of the GATT agreement which deals " "with patents does not require software patents. Many experts who have " "studied this, for instance in Europe, make this claim. And the reason is " "that they interpret technical effect as: there is a specific physical " "consequence or physical system going on. And so the software that doesn't " "do that doesn't have to be in the domain that patents can cover." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So, at least you don't have to worry about the Word Trade Organization " "causing problems here, despite the tremendous problems they cause in other " "areas of life." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Preventing India from having software patents will be up to you—to the " "citizens of India. I am a foreigner, I have no influence except when I can " "convince other people through the logic of what I say. There is a chance " "that you can do this. When the US started to have software patents, the " "public policy question was not considered at all. Nobody even asked whether " "it was a good idea to have software patents. The Supreme Court made a " "decision which was then twisted around by an appeals court, and ever since " "then, there were software patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "But when Europe started to consider officially authorizing software patents " "a few years ago, public opposition started to rise and became so strong that " "the politicians and the parties began paying attention to it, and started " "saying they were against it. In fact two attempts to authorize software " "patents have been blocked already in Europe. The French Minister of " "Industry says that software patents would be a disaster and under no " "circumstances should they be allowed in France. All of the German political " "parties have taken a stand against software patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "The battle is not yet over, you know. We have not conclusively blocked " "software patents in Europe, because the multinational companies and their " "servant, the United States government, is lobbying very hard, and they have " "ignorance on their side. It's so easy for somebody with a naive neo-liberal " "view to be persuaded that a new kind of monopoly has to be good!" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "You have to look at the details of how software patents affect software " "development to see that they cause a problem. You have to study that " "economic research in its mathematics in order to see why you shouldn't " "assume that patents always promote progress. So, it's easy for IBM to send " "a lobbyist to someone and say: “You should really adopt software " "patents, they are great for programming. And look, the US is ahead and the " "US has software patents. If you have software patents too, you might catch " "up.” Well, you can't get more dominant than that, and the US was ahead " "in computers before it had software patents, it can't be because of software " "patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "It's important to understand that each country has its own patent system and " "its own patent laws and what you do in a certain country is under the " "jurisdiction of that country's patent law. So the result is, that if the US " "has software patents, the US becomes a sort of battleground where anybody " "using computers might get sued. If India avoids software patents, then " "India is not a battleground, and computer users in India do not face this " "danger of getting sued." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "It turns out that each country will issue patents to foreigners, just as to " "its own citizens. So in fact, in a place which has this scourge of software " "patents, foreigners can own those patents. There are lots of non-US " "companies that own US software patents, so they are all welcome to get " "involved in the fighting in the US. Of course it's we Americans who become " "the victims of this. Meanwhile, in India, if there are no software patents, " "that means both Indian companies and foreign companies are prevented from " "coming into India and attacking people with software patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So, yes it is important that each country has its own patent law. That " "makes a big difference, but you've got to understand what difference it " "makes. Having software patents in a certain country is not an advantage for " "the developers in that country. It's a problem for anybody distributing and " "using software in that country." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Now, if you in India are developing a program for use in the US, you may " "face the problem—or at least your client will face the " "problem—of US software patents. At least probably you can't get sued " "here. The client who commissioned the program and tries to use it might get " "sued in the US, and indeed you will have to deal with the problem—the " "US's problems—when you try doing business in the US. But at least " "you'll be safe here. You know, at least it is a big difference between your " "client got sued because your client told you to make a product and that " "product is patented, versus you get sued for making that product." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "If there are software patents in India, then you will get sued. Whereas in " "the current situation, at least you can say to the client: “You told " "us to make this and we made it. So, I'm sorry this happened to you but it's " "not our fault.” Whereas if there are software patents in India, you'll " "get sued yourself and there is nothing you can say about that." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "Businesses should demand opposition to software patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So the ultimate conclusion is that software patents tie all software " "developers, all computer users and essentially all businesses in a new kind " "of bureaucracy, which serves no beneficial social purpose. So it's a bad " "policy and it should be avoided." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Businesses don't like bureaucracy. If businesses knew that they were " "threatened with a new kind of bureaucracy, they would oppose software " "patents very strongly. But most of them aren't aware of this." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "In the US, software patents have led directly to business method patents. " "What does this mean? A business method is basically how you make decisions " "about what to do in the business. And in the past, these decisions were " "made by humans but now sometimes they are made by computers, and that means " "they are carried out by software, and that means the decision policies can " "be patented. Software patents imply business method patents and business " "procedure patents. The result is that any business could find itself, you " "know, once they decide “we're going to automate the way we carry out " "our procedures,” now they get sued with a software patent." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So if businesses only knew, they would be organizing through things like the " "chamber of commerce to demand opposition to software patents. But mostly " "they don't know, and therefore it's going to be your job to inform them. " "Make sure they understand the danger that they are facing." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "It's important for countries to work together against this." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "And then India may be able, with the help of other countries like France and " "Germany, to reject software patents. It is important for people in the " "Indian government to make contact with officials in European countries, so " "that this battle against software patents doesn't have to be fought one " "country at a time, so that countries can work together to adopt an " "intelligent policy. Maybe there should be a <em>no software patents " "treaty</em> that various countries can sign and promise each other aid, when " "they are threatened by economic pressure from the United States, as part of " "its economic imperialism." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Because the United States likes to do that, you know. One of the provisions " "in the GATT agreement is that countries have the right to make compulsory " "licenses for making medicine, to address a public health crisis. And the " "South-African government proposed to do this for medicine against AIDS. " "Now, South-Africa has a very bad problem with AIDS; the figures I've heard " "was that a quarter of the adult population is infected. And of course, most " "of them can't afford to buy these medicines at the prices charged by the US " "companies." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So the South-African government was going to issue compulsory licenses " "which, even under GATT, it's allowed to do. But the US government " "threatened economic sanctions. Vice-President Gore was directly involved " "with this. And then, about a year before the presidential election, he " "realized that this was going to look bad, so he dropped out of the effort." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "But this kind of thing is what the US government does all the time in regard " "to patents and copyrights. They don't even mind if people get patented to " "death." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "So it's important for countries to work together against this." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "For more information about the problem of software patents, see <a " "href=\"https://web.archive.org/web/20150329202214/http://www.progfree.org/Patents/Gif/Gif.html\">www.progfree.org</a> " "[archived] and <a href=\"http://www.ffii.org\">www.ffii.org</a>. And there " "is also a petition to sign, www.noepatents.org <a href=\"#Note1\" " "id=\"Note1-rev\">[1]</a>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Please talk with all executives of businesses—any kind of " "businesses—about this issue. Make sure they understand the extent of " "the problems they face, and that they think of going to business " "organizations to have them lobby against software patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h3> msgid "Questions from the audience" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "Now I'll answer questions." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "Oh, by the way to any journalists who are here, I recommend writing articles " "about software patents separately from articles about free software. If you " "cover them in one article together, people may get the idea that software " "patents are only bad for free software developers and they are okay for " "other software developers. This is not true. If you think back of what I " "have said, hardly any of it relates to the question of whether the programs " "are free or not; the dangers are the same for all software developers. So " "please don't take the risk, the people will get confused. Write separate " "articles." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "Questions about software patents" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sir, you said that companies like IBM are harmed about 10 times as " "much as they benefit?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: No. What I said is the harm that would have happened to them is " "10 times the benefit, but this harm is purely theoretical, it doesn't " "occur. You see, they avoid it through cross-licensing. So in fact, the " "harm does not happen." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: But it is only neutralized, they don't really benefit?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, they do you see, because the bad aspect, they avoid through " "cross-licensing, and meanwhile they do collect money from some other " "licenses. So they are benefiting in total. There is the small benefit " "which happens and the big potential harm which does not happen. So you have " "zero plus something for the benefit." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: But for that something will oppose this movement against patents?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Right, IBM favors software patents. I had with trouble one, I " "couldn't hear all the words in your sentence. I don't know whether there " "was a “not” in it. I couldn't tell, there are two diametrically " "opposite meanings for what you just said, so what you can do is make sure " "that the situation is clear. IBM favors software patents, IBM thinks it " "stands to gain a lot from software patents. So what it stands to gain is " "that the IBM and the other very big companies would basically control " "software development, because it will be very hard to do independent " "software development." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "To develop nontrivial programs you're going to have to infringe patents of " "IBM's. Now if you are big and often lucky enough, you might have some " "patents of your own and make IBM cross-license with you. Otherwise you are " "completely at their mercy and you have to hope that they just let you pay " "the money." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "Is someone else asking?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sir, what was the reason for the development of the software " "patent?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, in the US, there was no reason. Somebody tried to get a " "patent that was a software patent, and, I think, the patent office said no, " "so he took it to court and eventually went to the Supreme Court and they, " "they didn't judge it as a public policy question, they judged it in terms of " "what does the law say." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: So was it not the realization that…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Sorry, I can't … could you try to pronounce your consonants " "more clearly, I'm having trouble understanding the words." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: So was it not the realization that copyright is notoriously weak " "for protecting software?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Copyright is not only what?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Notoriously weak…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, I think the whole sentence is nonsensical. I don't " "understand this term “protecting software,” and I don't agree " "with you." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "Most programmers don't agree with you." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: So when you are saying that you are not favoring protection of " "software and you yourself is giving General Public License, where do you get " "that power to issue General Public License?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: OK, you are asking questions about copyright and free software " "which is not the topic now, I will accept questions about that later on, but " "I gave a speech about software patents and I want to answer questions about " "software patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sir I have a question about software patents, the thing is that " "how can one protect where there is a functional element…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Protect what?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Functional element…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: What's going to happen to them?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Sir, how can we get a protection when there is a…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Protection from what? Somebody's gonna come with a gun?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: No Sir…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Basically the protection you need is the protection against being " "sued for the program you wrote. Programmers need protection from software " "patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: No, it's not the programmers themselves sir, there are companies " "who have invested in something." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: And do you want the company to get sued because in your large " "program there are five different things that somebody, that five different " "people already patented? Now it's clear to see the myth that you are " "operating on, it's the naive idea that, when <em>you</em> develop a program, " "<em>you</em> will have the patent. Well, the idea, that very statement " "contains a mistake because there is no such thing as <em>the patent.</em> " "When you develop a program with many different things in it, there are many " "things, each of which might be patented by somebody else already, and you " "find out about them one by one when they come to you, saying: “either " "pay us a lot of money, or else shut down.” And when you dealt with " "five of them, you never know when number six is going to come along. It's " "much safer to be in the software field if you know you are not going to get " "sued as long as you wrote the program yourself." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "That's the way it was before software patents. If you wrote the program " "yourself there was nothing to sue you about. Today you can write the " "program yourself, it may even be a useful and innovative program, but " "because you didn't reinvent the whole field, you use some ideas that were " "already known, other people sue you. Now, of course, those people who wanna " "go around suing you, they are going to pretend that this extortion is " "protection for them. Protection from what? Protection from having " "competitors, I guess. They don't believe in competition, they want " "monopolies." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "Well, to hell with them. It's not good for the public that they should get " "what they want. This is a question of public policy. We have to decide " "what is good for the citizens <em>generally</em>." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "<b>Audience</b>: <i>[applause]</i>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "Not have somebody saying “I wanna have a monopoly because I think I am " "so important I should have one, so protect me from anybody else being " "allowed to develop software.”" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: You are suggesting that we should avoid making a battleground for " "patents, don't we still have to deal with the problem that there are a lot " "of American products being sold here and…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Well…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: … and we are still going to be mistaken…?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: No! No, you misunderstood. US developers may be in trouble " "because of the patent system, and what effect will that have? It means that " "there are certain products that won't be coming from the US, and therefore " "they won't be sold in the US, or here. You see, if a developer is in the US " "and there is a US software patent, that software developer is going to get " "sued there, whether or not he tries to deal with anybody in India, he is " "going to get sued. But the fact that he is distributing the program in " "India is not going to cause him an additional problem, because that's under " "the jurisdiction of India. That's the one thing he will <em>not</em> get " "sued for. So, basically, what it means is, whatever exists can be " "distributed in India, safely, and the developers who are lucky enough to be " "in India will be safe from this kind of gang warfare, and those who are " "unlucky enough to be in the US will not be safe." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sir, are you basically against the very concept of intellectual " "property rights?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: As I said at the beginning, it is foolish to even think about that " "topic. That topic is an overgeneralization. It lumps together totally " "different things like copyrights and patents, and so any opinion about " "“intellectual property” is a foolish one. I don't have an " "opinion about intellectual property, I have opinions about copyrights, and I " "have completely different opinions about patents, and even in the area of " "patents, you know, I have different opinions in different fields. Even that " "area is a big area. And then there are trademarks which are also " "“intellectual property”; I think trademarks are basically a good " "idea. The US has taken trademarks all little too far but, basically it is " "reasonable to have labels that you can rely on." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "So you shouldn't try to have an opinion about intellectual property. If you " "are thinking about intellectual property, you are thinking at a simplistic " "level. And any conclusions you reach will be simplistic. So, do as I do, " "you know, pick one topic at a time and focus on it, and find out the details " "about that one area, then you can think intelligently about that area, and " "later on you can think intelligently about the other areas too." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: So there is an argument that if particular intellectual property " "right is not protected…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry, what you are saying makes no sense at all and is at " "this foolish general level…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Let me complete sir, if that particular intellectual property " "right is not protected, it may impede the investment, and this " "impediment…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: This generalistic thinking is so simplistic, it's totally " "stupid. It makes no sense at all. There is no principle of intellectual " "property. Copyrights and patents and trademarks originated completely " "separately, they have nothing in common, except later somebody else made up " "this term “intellectual property” to call them all by it." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Sir, will you extend this concept to the physical property?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: No, I'm sorry, none of these things has anything to do with " "physical property rights, they are totally different. What do you say " "extend “this concept”? Which is “this concept”? The " "idea that the term “intellectual property” is a generalization " "that leads you into simplistic thinking, should we apply that to physical " "property? No, they are totally different. They have nothing in common." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: So the basis under which this intellectual property is protected " "is “protect the labor,” “intellectual labor”?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: No! No, you are totally wrong, you are totally wrong. The purpose " "of… You have been brainwashed, you have been listening to the " "propaganda of the companies that want to have these monopolies. If you ask " "what legal scholars say is the basis of these systems, they say that they " "are attempts—for copyrights and for patents—they are attempts to " "manipulate the behavior of people to get benefit for the public. Trademarks " "are a different issue, I think the issues for trademark are completely " "different. So you are making an overgeneralization also." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: So why can't we extend the very same principle…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: But in any case, your principle is <em>wrong</em>, and if you take " "a look at that economic research on www.researchoninnovation.org, you will " "see that you are making naive statements, naive blanket statements that are " "simply not true. You got the silly idea that creating a monopoly over some " "aspect of life <em>always</em>, <em>invariably</em> makes that aspect of " "life thrive. Well, this is dumb. Occasionally it might work, and " "occasionally it causes a lot of trouble." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Don't you think that the same kind of monopoly is created in favor " "of a party when he owns a physical property?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry, I can't hear you." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sir, don't you think that the same kind of monopoly rights are " "created if a particular physical property is allowed to be owned by a " "person, just like an intellectual property?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Physical property can only be in one place at a time. You know, " "only one person can sit in a chair at a time in the normal way. " "<i>[Applause]</i> You know these are totally different issues. You know, " "trying to generalize to the utmost is a foolish thing to do. We're dealing " "with complicated laws that have many, many, many complicated details and you " "are asking us to ignore all these details. We're dealing with laws that have " "complicated effects in various fields and you are asking us to ignore the " "details of their effects. Don't bother judging… I think that if we " "are talking about a public policy issue, we've got to look at the actual " "results of the policy, not some myth as to what results a certain ideology " "would predict. I'm telling you the real results, I'm telling you what I " "have seen and what other programmers have seen." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Sir, what about the LZW patent? Is it…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: What about the <em>what</em>?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: LZW patent?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: The LZW patent?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Yeah. Is it still in effect?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Yes, it is. Well, there are actually two LZW patents as I " "explained to you, and they are both still in effect." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Sir, so it's for 20 years?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Yeah, it's not 20 years yet." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sir, can you reduce the scope of the problem by reducing the " "period of the patent?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Definitely, you could. If there were software patents, but they " "only lasted for, say, 5 years or three years, that would mostly solve the " "problem. Yes it's a pain to have to wait 3 or 5 years, but it's much, much " "less of a pain. But, but there is a difficulty there. The GATT agreement " "says that patents must last 20 years. So, the only way you could have " "something like software patents which lasted for 3 or 5 years is as follows." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "First, make it clear that ordinary patents do not apply, and second, if you " "wish, you could create a different system of five-year software idea " "monopolies. Well, it's not clear that there is any particular benefit in " "these five-year software monopolies but it would be much better than the " "current situation. So if you found the government prepared to make this " "deal, well, I would say, we should take it. But, but we have to realize, " "though, that the first step is to abolish software patents strictly " "speaking, and that has to be part of this deal." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: So and patent has also now become victim of…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry, I couldn't hear you at all, could you speak louder?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sir, patent has now become a way of making money by businesses " "rather than promoting inventions?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Yes, a lot of them use it that way." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: So, sir, can we reduce this problem further by assigning the " "patent to the actual inventor rather than a business?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Not really. What you'll find is that, that aspect of the " "relationship between the employee and the business is something that gets " "negotiated; and the business has more clout, so they are always going to end " "up arranging to have the employee hand the patent to the company. The other " "thing is that it doesn't make a big difference who owns the patent. The " "point is that you are prohibited from developing a program using that idea, " "and it may make some difference precisely who has the power to sue you. But " "what you really want is not to be sued at all. So why look for a " "half-measure like this? It's much better just to say that software shouldn't " "have patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "Okay, if you gonna pass a note, you'd better read it out loud. Any other " "questions?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: People who are being to Malaysia say that, if we buy a PC there, " "the amount of money we would pay for all the standard software is about a " "tenth of what we should pay in this country. In Malaysia they are little " "more relaxed about patents and copyrights?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, are you not sure what you are talking about? Because you " "seem to mixing together copyrights and patents. I'm not sure if what you " "are talking about has anything to do with the issue of software patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Precisely what I want to know is about: this has something to do " "with patents?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Probably not." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Different countries depending on how much, whether they are part " "of WTO or not part of WTO…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: No, no." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: …I think matter…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: You see, I don't know for certain because I don't know what's " "going on there. I've never been there. But I suspect that it's a matter of " "copyright and has nothing to do with patents, because if you are talking " "about the same programs… Remember, software patents are primarily a " "restriction on software developers. So if it's the same program and it was " "developed, say, in the US, the patent problems they have are independent of, " "you know… the patent problems they have are biggest in the US, not in " "either India or Malaysia. So, that probably has to do with copyright, not " "patents, and that's a totally different issue. We mustn't lump these issues " "together." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Sir earlier you've told that…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry I can't hear you." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Earlier in your speech you've told that software that should be " "brought under the purvey of patents is what you defined that as what can be " "run on a general purpose machine." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I'm afraid I can't… Can anyone understand what he's saying? " "I cannot understand your words. If you make an effort to enunciate more " "clearly, I may be able to understand." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: You had spoken earlier that software that should be patented is, " "you defined that as, software that can be run on a general purpose " "machine…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry I didn't say that software <em>should</em> be patented, " "so I just can't make out these words. Maybe if you tell that to someone " "else, the other person could say it and I could understand." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Software patents, like whatever you call software patents, like " "those are what can be run on a general purpose machine. So if some " "algorithm or some piece of software is capable of being executed on a " "general purpose machine, it should not be patented." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Yes. Now I can hear you, yes. One of the things I proposed was " "that patent should not apply to software for general purpose machines or the " "use of it on those general purpose machines. So that if you develop that " "program or if you are using that program, you couldn't be sued." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: We've an increasing number of software not being run on general " "purpose machines." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, then that would be covered still by software patents, so it " "wouldn't be a total a solution, but at least it would be a partial solution." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: So if the defining line is general purpose machines, don't you see " "there's a possibility that people could find loopholes in it, like, to find " "workarounds for…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry. Do I see a possibility that people would do what?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: … of finding loopholes or workarounds of converting what " "you would call software patents and to get it actually patented." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry, I do not understand. Loopholes to do… I'm " "sorry. What people would do, what software developers would do in that " "situation is use general purpose machines more." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Some algorithm can be run on a general purpose machine—what " "I'd say that, that algorithm, I'm using it for some embedded device and go " "ahead and patent it." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Why you could try it, you misunderstood. The point is that, you " "misunderstood what the solution is. The solution is that if I am developing " "and using the software on general purpose machines, then nobody can sue me " "for patent infringement. So yes, somebody could get a patent, and maybe he " "could sue others who are doing specialized things which involve particular " "hardware. But they couldn't sue me." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Excuse me sir, may I ask you a question." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Yes." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sir, you spoke of general purpose machines. In the sense, how " "would you define these machines, because these days you have a lot of custom " "made handheld devices etc. Now some way…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: No, handheld computers are general purpose when they are not " "designed to carry out a specific computation or a specific physical " "process. They're general purpose computers. They have general purpose " "computer chips in them." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Then the idea would be contestable in a court of law as to whether " "it's a general purpose or not…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I guess, it will have to be, yeah. The precise details of drawing " "those lines, one ends up having to leave to judges." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Thank you sir." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Germany and France, the only countries who has said no to patents " "in Europe…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, I don't know the full situation. Those are the just the " "ones I know of. The last time there was a vote, there were going to be a " "majority of <em>no</em> votes, and so they dropped the issue. And I don't " "remember the other countries." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: There's no European community decision on this…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Not yet. In fact, the European Commission itself is divided. One " "of the agencies—the one which unfortunately is the lead agency on this " "issue—has been won over by the multinationals and is in favor of " "software patents, and then the agency that tries to encourage software " "development is against them, and so they're trying to work against it. So " "if there is somebody who wants to get in touch with the official in charge " "of the agency that is opposed to software patents, I can put them in touch." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Is there any country that said no to software patents?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, there are countries which don't have them, but it's not " "clear that there's any country which has affirmed this recently." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sir, could you please elaborate on the benefits the software " "development community got in European countries from this policy?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, the benefit is that you don't have to be afraid someone will " "sue you, because of one of the ideas or a combination of ideas that you used " "in a program that you wrote. Basically software patents mean that if you " "write a program, somebody else might sue you and say “you're not " "allowed to write that program.” The benefit of not having software " "patents is you're safe from that." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "Now in India you have probably taken for granted that you are safe from " "that. But that will only last as long as there are no software patents in " "India." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Are there any threats to India not acceding to the software " "regime?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well there's no software regime. The GATT agreement doesn't " "require software patents. There is no treaty requiring software patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Most people, if they had a chance to get a patent and make a lot " "of money out of it, they wouldn't pass it up…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, many people if they had a chance to get a gun and make a lot " "of money from, they wouldn't pass it up." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "The point is, therefore, let we try not to hand them that opportunity. For " "instance, we don't have a government agency handing out guns to people on " "the street, and we should not have a government agency handing out software " "patents to people on the street either." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Being an advocate of this non-patency, have you ever faced " "any…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I'm having trouble hearing you. Please try to make an effort to " "pronounce every sound clearly that I might understand." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: You being an advocate of this non-patency, have you faced any " "problems with these multinationals or something?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Have I faced any problems…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: … so far in your life?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry. What did he say?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Have you faced any problems with multinationals in your life?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, there are many. In the community where I develop software, " "there are many examples of programs that had their features taken out, " "programs that didn't have the feature put in the first place, programs that " "were not even written for many years, because of this. There are many " "examples of jobs we can't do, because we're not allowed to do them." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "Now we collected examples of this, and we are looking for people to write " "them up—you know, to look at each example and investigate it fully and " "write down a clear description of what happened and what the harm was and so " "on. We have had trouble finding people to do this. We're looking for " "more. So someone who is really good at writing clear English might want to " "volunteer for this." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: I think he asked whether you had any threat to you by any " "multinational companies…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Well they never threatened my life!" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Yeah that's the question!" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: No, but they do threaten our work. You know, they do threaten to " "sue us." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h4> msgid "Questions about free software" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Volunteer</b>: There's a question from a gentleman at the back: “If " "the multinational companies that produce hardware, like Intel, coming to a " "contract with big software companies to restrict free software by changing " "the microprocessor patents, how will you overcome such a hazard?”" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I see very little danger of that. Intel recently developed a new " "computer architecture, and far from trying to stop us from supporting it, " "they hired people to implement it." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "So it looks like we have now moved to free software questions. I'd like to " "remind people that, until this last answer, I was not speaking for the Free " "Software movement. I was speaking about something of vital interest to " "every programmer which is: to be free to write programs and not get sued for " "having written them, as long as you wrote it yourself. And that is a freedom " "that you've taken for granted until now, and it's a freedom you will lose if " "you have software patents." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "Now however we're moving to the topic of free software, which is what I " "spent most of my time working on, and the individual, the actual software " "development project that I've lead, which is developing the GNU operating " "system, which is a free software, Unix-like operating system used by some " "twenty million people estimated today. So I am now going to start answering " "questions about free software and GNU." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: In the absence of a concrete revenue model for free software, will " "this also go bust like the dotcom?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I can't predict the future but I want to remind you that the " "dotcoms were businesses. And free software is not primarily a business. " "There are some free software businesses. Whether they will succeed or " "ultimately fail, I don't know. But those businesses, while they contribute " "to our community, they are not what our community is all about. What our " "community is all about is having the freedom to redistribute and study and " "change software. A lot of free software is developed by volunteers, and the " "amount is increasing. No matter what happens with the companies, that's not " "going away." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: I understand that companies like IBM are also investing " "considerably in making their systems and software compatible with free " "source code like Linux…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: You mean GNU?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: All right…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Yes, they call it Linux. Actually the system is mainly GNU and " "Linux is one of the pieces." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>[From audience]</b> The kernel is hardly eighteen percent." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Well, really, that much? What I saw is three percent." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>[From audience]</b> You can see through a needle. Very insignificant." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: But, I also understand that they've invested around a billion " "dollars in doing so. Now my question is…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Well that's not true." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: My question is: for a service that has no revenue model, will this " "be sustainable in the future, and if I change my business into…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry, I can't predict the future. No one can." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: How can I…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: There are some God men who claim they can predict the future. I'm " "not. I'm a rationalist." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "I can't tell you what's going to happen. What I can tell you is that when " "IBM claims to have put a billion dollars into the GNU plus Linux operating " "system, that is not entirely true. You have to look carefully at what " "they're spending this money on, and you'll find they are spending this money " "on various different things, some contribute and some don't." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "For instance, they are funding some work on developing the GNU/Linux " "system. That's good, that contributes. They do develop some other free " "software packages that they've contributed to the community. That's a real " "contribution." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "They are also developing many nonfree programs to make them run with the " "GNU/Linux system and that is not a contribution. And they are publicizing " "the system, well, it's not a primary contribution but it does help, you " "know. Having more users is not our primary goal. But it's nice, if more " "people would try our software, so that does help, but then they're " "mistakenly calling this Linux which is not quite right, and they're lobbying " "for software patents in Europe, which is bad. So, you know, IBM is doing " "many different things. Some are good and some are bad, and if you want to " "have a thoughtful view, it's important to look at the individual actions. " "Do not try to add it up because that just means you're missing the important " "aspects of the situation." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "Are there any more questions?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: […]" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I can't hear you at all, I'm sorry […] whispering. I'm a " "little bit hard of hearing, and when you combine that with the noise of the " "fans, and with the unusual accent, all three of those things together make " "very hard for me to make out the words." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: This question is not about patent or copyright or anything like " "that. But this is one example what you said about—<code>if</code> " "statement and <code>while</code> statement—that you said something " "about the differences in the field of computer science and differences with " "other sciences, that is other engineering sciences. You said that if I " "change something in the <code>if</code> loop that's <code>if</code> " "statement, there won't be any effect, that you said…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: No I didn't say that." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: You said that! You said that there isn't any heating effect. I " "remember that…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry, I know what I said. I said something that's partly " "similar to that…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: I'll tell the exact statement: you said there won't any heating " "effect." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Any whating effect?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Heating effect. Heating…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Oh yes we don't have to worry about how much heat the " "<code>if</code> statement…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Yeah, yeah, exactly. Then what is it that cascading effect is? If " "I change the structure of the loop, there will be an effect." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Oh sure. The program will behave differently when you change it, " "but I'm not saying that writing every program is easy, or that we never make " "mistakes. I listed a lot of specific kinds of problems, that would plague a " "mechanical or electrical engineer at every little detail. Even each one " "detail gets to be very hard for them. Whereas for us, the problems are " "because we do so much, we're doing it so fast, we don't think carefully " "about each one thing. So we make mistakes." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: So you admit that there's an effect." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Of course. I never said otherwise, I'm sorry if you thought so. " "Sure if you change your program it's going to do different things." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Sir, can you comment on the commercial distributions?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, you asked me to comment on the commercial distribution of " "GNU/Linux systems? Well, I think that's fine. That's one of the freedoms " "that free software gives you—the freedom to use it in business, the " "freedom to distribute it as part of a business, the freedom to sell copies " "in exchange for money. These are all legitimate." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "Now, one thing I am unhappy about is when the companies that do this add " "some nonfree software to it." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: That's the installation program?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Yeah, any nonfree software. Because the goal was: you should be " "able to get a completely free operating system. Well, if they have a thing " "in a store which says I'm the GNU/Linux system— of course it says " "Linux—but inside of it there are some nonfree programs, now you're not " "getting something that is entirely free anymore. It doesn't entirely " "respect your freedom. So the real goal for which we wrote the system is " "being lost." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "So that's a major problem that our community faces now, the tendency to put " "free software together with nonfree software and make these nonfree overall " "systems. And then, you know, it might seem that our software is a success " "because there are many people using it. But if you look at our real goal, " "our real goal is not popularity. Our real goal is to spread a community of " "freedom, and we're not succeeding in doing that if the people are using " "nonfree software still." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "Unfortunately, I couldn't give both speeches. I can give a speech about " "software patents, or I can give a speech about free software. They're very " "different and each one of them is a long speech. So unfortunately what that " "means is that I can't fully explain about free software and the GNU project " "here. Am I giving another speech in Kochi? Am I giving the free software " "speech in Kochi?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: No." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Oh well. I gave that speech in Trivandrum." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "So I'll answer five more questions and then I'll have to call it quits " "because it gets to be quite draining to answer so many." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Excuse me sir, question from me again. Sir, this is a personal " "question. Me, as such, I love programming. I spend a lot of time in front " "of my system. And I was listening to some of your earlier speeches where " "you said that back in the 70's, the community of programmers had a sense of " "goodwill among them. They used to share code, they used to develop on it." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, a specific community of programmers which I belonged to. " "This was not all programmers. It was one specific community. Continue." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Yes sir. In that context, I feel particularly, me as such, I feel " "very hurt when I see the so-called interaction among programmers today. " "Because many of us are very good programmers, but we look at each other in " "different colors depending upon the tools we use— “hey, he's a " "windows guy,” “hey, he's a GNU/Linux guy,” “hey, " "he's into Solaris systems,” “he's a network programmer.” " "And unfortunately most of this prejudice comes from a lot of " "misinterpretation out of things like this. None of these people promote " "free software as such, and it hurts me as a programmer and many of my " "colleagues, and I work in an environment…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Could you speak a bit more slowly, I am hearing most of it, but " "there was one point that I miss, so if you speak slowly I will…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Yeah, here we work with in an environment where you are judged " "according to the tools you use rather than the quality of work." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: To me that, well, in one sense there is a situation where in a " "limited way that is rational. If there is a tool which is normally used for " "doing fairly easy jobs and there are lot of people who now had to do it, " "then I would imagine now, I wouldn't want, I might not pay as much to them " "as somebody who does very hard jobs with a different tool that's used for " "hard jobs. But it's true if you're talking about hard jobs, it makes no " "sense that you'd be prejudiced about what tools people are using. The good " "programmers can use any tools." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: That was not the focus here. The focus was that here it is a " "question of goodwill. Goodwill amongst programmers these days seems to be, " "you know, melted out into these little boxes of this system and that system, " "and that hurts." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I agree we should encourage people to learn about more different " "things and we should never be prejudiced against people because of some " "detail, you know the fact that this person likes Perl and this person likes " "C, why should they hate each other…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: It's not even that distinct. It's like this person works on " "GNU/Linux and this person works on Windows, which are the two major " "operating systems today in India at least." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, in that case, though, it's not just a prejudice, you see. " "Windows is a system, a social system, that keeps people helpless and divided " "<i>[applause]</i>, whereas GNU/Linux is an alternative that was created " "specifically to liberate people and to encourage them to cooperate. So to " "some extent, this is not like: “where you born in this country or that " "country?” No, this is like your choice of politics. And it does make " "sense to criticize people for their choices about important issues." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "So, I would say, a person who's using Windows, well, either he is actively " "supporting this power structure, or at least maybe he's trapped in it and " "doesn't have the courage to get out. In that case you can forgive him, I " "guess, and encourage him. You know, there are different situations of " "people; in any place there are people… different. Some people are " "making more or less effort to try to improve things. I believe in judging " "people as individuals, not as lumping them together by their groups." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "But this is, in this one case it is, somewhat of a political choice with " "political consequences for society, and that's exactly where it makes sense " "to criticize people." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sorry to continue again on this, but I'm a little persistent about " "this. It's…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: This is your last chance." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Yes sir, thank you. Generally when statements like these are " "made, people who are not so much, you know, in connection with these things " "tend to assume that cooperative communities and sharing of source code and " "sharing of ideas and things like that don't exist in other environments, but " "they do, and that's very unfortunate that they think so." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry… <em>What</em> don't exist in other environments? " "I don't know which other environments you're talking about. I don't " "understand." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Other programming environments, other operating systems." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well maybe there are some users developing some free software that " "runs on Windows, in fact I'm sure there are…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "" "<em>Note: At this point, there was a short blackout, and both the recording " "and the transcript is incomplete here.</em>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, maybe there, are there anymore questions? Could you speak " "louder? I can't hear you at all." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Sir may I ask you a question?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: Okay you can, sure." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: In free software system we will be distributing the source code " "also together with the software. So a person is entitled to change whatever " "he can in the source code. So don't you think there will be too many " "software versions of a particular software and this will in turn cause " "problems for a layman to find out which will suit him the most." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Practical experience is that this is not a problem. And " "occasionally it happens, but not very often. Now, you see, the reason is " "that the users want interoperability and with free software the users are " "ultimately in control, and what they want they tend to get. The free " "software developers realize that they had better—if they are going to " "make incompatible changes they are likely to make users unhappy and their " "versions are not going to be used. So they generally draw the obvious " "conclusion and pay a lot of attention to interoperability." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: What I feel is that like I'll be just loading a software into my " "computer and the next morning I'll find a better version then again I'll " "have to change it. The next morning again something has been done to the " "source code and that's a better version, so don't you…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: In general you are not going be finding a better version every day " "and the reason is that typically for any given program, there is usually " "only one version that is widely used. Maybe there will be two, once in a " "while there will be three—when there is no good maintainer that might " "happen. So you are just not going to keep finding out about more versions " "that are good every day; there aren't so many. There won't be that many " "popular versions. There is one situation where you can get a new version " "every day. That is when there is one team doing a lot of work on " "development then every day you can get their latest version. That you can " "do. But that's only one version at any given time." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Sir, don't you think we will have to implement an organization " "which will take into consideration all these updations and it will just " "provide a single software which will have all the updations right?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I'm sorry, I didn't hear that. Shouldn't we have an organization " "that would do something with all these versions, but I don't know what." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Like, say I have developed a version of…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Did anyone else hear what she said? Could anyone else tell me what " "she said?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: The thing is that…" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: It's a very valuable skill to learn to speak slowly and clearly. " "If you ever want to give a speech, which as part of your career you will, " "it's very helpful to learn to enunciate clearly and slowly." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Thank you, Sir. Sir, the thing is that, don't you feel that we " "require an organization which will just perform a number of updations " "together and make available a software which will club all the updations up " "to that date?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: You are saying, take various different applications and put them " "together?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Yes Sir." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I will tell you. A lot of organizations are doing that; in fact " "every one of the GNU/Linux distributions is exactly that. Debian does that, " "Red Hat does that… We to some extent do that also for the GNU " "packages. We work on making sure they work together." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Excuse me Sir. We have talked lot against patents. In US " "conditions have you ever been forced to put forward any applications for " "patents?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "<b>A</b>: No. But no one can force me to make a patent application." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Also do you own any patents?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: I do not own any patents. Now, I have considered the possibility " "of applying for patents to use them as part of a <em>mutual strategic " "defense alliance</em>." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "" "<b>Q</b>: Do you mean to say that if I have twenty patents with me, I donate " "it to the FSF and you maintain it for me?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Well, not the FSF. It would be a separate specialized " "organization that would exist specifically, so that we would all contribute " "our patents and the organization would use all of these patents to shelter " "anyone who wishes shelter. So anyone can join the organization, even " "somebody who has no patents. And that person gets the shelter of this " "organization. But then we all do try to get patents so as to make the " "organization stronger so it can protect us all better. That's the idea, but " "so far no one has been able to get this started. It's not an easy thing to " "do, and part of the reason is that applying for a patent is very " "expensive—and a lot of work as well." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd><p> msgid "So this will be the last question." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dt> msgid "<b>Q</b>: Why can't the Free Software Foundation start its own distribution?" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><dl><dd> msgid "" "<b>A</b>: Oh well, the reason is that Debian is almost what we want, and it " "seems better to be friends with Debian and try to convince them to change it " "a little, rather than say “well, we are not going to use it; we are " "going to make our own thing.” And also it seems likely to be more " "successful too because, after all, there are a lot of people working on " "Debian already. Why try to make an alternative to that large community. " "Much better to work with them and convince them to support our goals " "better—if it works, of course, and we have our ways to go on that." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "So that was the last question, I can't stay all day answering questions, I'm " "sorry. So at this point I am going to have to call a halt and get going, " "and go have lunch. So thank you for listening." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "<i>[Applause]</i>" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><h3> msgid "Footnote" msgstr "" #. [Dead as of 2019-03-23], and a more recent one (now closed) can be found at <a #. href="http://stopsoftwarepatents.eu/"> #. stopsoftwarepatents.eu</a> #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "<a href=\"#Note1-rev\" id=\"Note1\">[1]</a> In 2014, this petition against " "software patents is <a " "href=\"http://web.archive.org/web/20061205023601/http://noepatents.org/index_html?NO_COOKIE=true\"> " "archived</a>." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "For more information about the problem of software patents, see also our <a " "href=\"https://endsoftwarepatents.org\">End Software Patents</a> campaign." msgstr "" #. TRANSLATORS: Use space (SPC) as msgstr if you don't have notes. #. type: Content of: <div> msgid "*GNUN-SLOT: TRANSLATOR'S NOTES*" msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><div><p> msgid "" "Please send general FSF & GNU inquiries to <a " "href=\"mailto:gnu@gnu.org\"><gnu@gnu.org></a>. There are also <a " "href=\"/contact/\">other ways to contact</a> the FSF. Broken links and " "other corrections or suggestions can be sent to <a " "href=\"mailto:webmasters@gnu.org\"><webmasters@gnu.org></a>." msgstr "" #. TRANSLATORS: Ignore the original text in this paragraph, #. replace it with the translation of these two: # #. We work hard and do our best to provide accurate, good quality #. translations. However, we are not exempt from imperfection. #. Please send your comments and general suggestions in this regard #. to <a href="mailto:web-translators@gnu.org"> # #. <web-translators@gnu.org></a>.</p> # #. <p>For information on coordinating and contributing translations of #. our web pages, see <a #. href="/server/standards/README.translations.html">Translations #. README</a>. #. type: Content of: <div><div><p> msgid "" "Please see the <a " "href=\"/server/standards/README.translations.html\">Translations README</a> " "for information on coordinating and contributing translations of this " "article." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "Copyright © 2001, 2008, 2012, 2021 Free Software Foundation, Inc." msgstr "" #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "" "This page is licensed under a <a rel=\"license\" " "href=\"http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nd/4.0/\">Creative Commons " "Attribution-NoDerivatives 4.0 International License</a>." msgstr "" #. TRANSLATORS: Use space (SPC) as msgstr if you don't want credits. #. type: Content of: <div><div> msgid "*GNUN-SLOT: TRANSLATOR'S CREDITS*" msgstr "" #. timestamp start #. type: Content of: <div><p> msgid "Updated:" msgstr ""